Turris Omnia (no wifi) vs APU4D4

Hi

Comparing Turris Omnia (no wifi model) to APU4D4, what are the pros/cons of each, with OpenWRT? Trying to understand, before committing.

Processor-wise, which is more performant? Which is more likely to be longer supported by OpenWRT community?

PC Engines has recently announced EOL for its APU devices, any implications from this?

Perhaps, any ideas of alternatives in the similar pricing space (under EUR 300, ideally even lower)?

Thanks!

different platforms, different bugs :wink:

no idea about the Turris, but the GX-412TC isn't any power horse.

x86 is always a safe bet, but I can imagine both being supported for a very long time.
yet, I wouldn't buy any of them :wink:

not really.

what are the requirements ?

The omnia sports a dual core 32bit arm a9 SoC ( Marvel Armada 385 CPU) at 1.6 GHz. The a9 from arm's performance line of CPUs was certainly a pretty nice performer for its time and power consumption, but the a9's design is from 2007 and is showing its age. Depending on what you want/need it can be plenty "good enough" (e.g. I use it on a 116/46 Mbps link with sqm-scripts traffic shaping to 105/45 with some bells and whistles), some years ago I benchmarked it with sqm-scripts to be capable of traffic shaping with MTU ~1500 at ~500/500 Mbps with bi directionally saturating loads, others report for uni-directional load traffic shaping up to 1 Gbps (I never tried to confirm that).

But honestly, unless you get a super special price both the Omnia and the APU4D4 are getting close to the end of their lives* and I would really look for something else, especially since 300 EUR should buy you a considerably more powerful x86 multicore device with >= 2 ethernet ports (e.g. search for intel's recent N100 platform). And these will not even consume all that much more power than a similarly powerful ARM based solution.

*) Turris is about to introduce a more modern omnia variant this autumn with a modern/faster SoC and a bunch of SFP+ cages that might hit your desires, but I see no chance this will end up close to the 300EUR you mentioned. There will hopefully also ba a successor for the "bread-and-butter" omnia in the future but that has not been announced at all yet, so no ETA or idea what performance to expect.

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In case, you look for highest performance, an APU4 is not for you.
However, in case you want to do sw development, try ubuntu wit all its packages, want rock solid hardware in a small form factor, you might check for second hand device, incl. SSD.
Being an old fan of PCEngines, I have to say: APUs are as reliable and solid as my old mechanical Swiss watch.

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I agree with @moeller0 's advice - turris omnia (especially WITHOUT wifi) doesn't worth the 300euros it asks. I've bought mine for less than 1/2 during the ks campaign a few years back and it was a great device back then but definitely overly expensive now.
as for the APU - too expensive again.
+1 too look into intel n100 devices

There's the Acemagic N95 at 188€, still too expensive, imho, but at least it's less than 300€.
Not sure two ports are enough for OP.

or perhaps offer the seller of this Cyberoam CR 25wiNG 25€.

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This comes not only without warranty, but also without a power supply unit, so it is well possible the seller never actually powered this on, and hence his classification as defect might actually be correct...

I agree, but for 30€, it might be worth the risk...

I probably would have snagged it myself, but I've already got a CR35Wing collecting dust on one of my shelves :wink:

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Thanks a lot for the insightful comments! I fully realized that both devices at their price tags do not have have price / horsepower one can find in Q3 2023.

N100 was an interesting mention - led me to another rabbit hole :slight_smile: My quick takeaway is that one can either:

  1. go for mini PC (dual-LAN) and repurpose that for OpenWRT device, e.g. Ace T8 Plus suggested by @frollic, Beelink, etc;
    or
  2. look for multi-port "industrial" firewall appliance. Most likely on AE, e.g. Topton, Moginsok, HUNSN, etc.

Option 1 devices in general have lower prices for the same CPU/RAM/storage, but 2 ports at best. Many option 2 devices are available now, but how does one pick the manufacturer [with PC Engines build quality]? :slight_smile:

I will take time to think of both options, potentially there will be more N100 devices hitting the market later in 2023.

Rather moderate. My ISP connection is 500Mbps. Looking for a device to support VPN for such throughput, ideally 5 ports (4 LAN + 1 WAN), 3 + 1 is OK, no need for SPF cage, LAN less than 10 devices. Potentially having RAM / storage cushion for the future, should I wish to experiement with more demanding packages.

Search the forum for the brand, or just ask.

Don't buy something off AX or Amazon with a name you've never heard of.

Go for brands known here, like Sophos, Roqos, Cyberoam, Trustwave, and most Lanner based hw.

If you only need 500mbit, good old Linksys WRT3200 might be a cheap alternative to wired only routers.

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When it comes to new/ modern 4-port mini-PCs in the N95/ N100 range, the aforementioned big market places are in the pole position with devices starting around 150-250 EUR/ USD. While you may find brandname devices cheap on the second hand market (with a manufacturing date ~5+ years in the past), their contemporary replacements start in the upper three to lower-mid four figure range.

Fortinet Fortigate 50E Firewall mit Adapter Firewall keine Lizenz funktioniert gut | eBay

Fortinet Fortigate 50E Firewall with Adapter Firewall No License Working well | eBay

It's the same cpu as the turris omnia.
But for vpn, wireguard is ok but if you need to use openvpn buy x86.

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Except none of these are actually sold from EU, VAT and custom fees need to be added.

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Well I didn't think about that.
It seems that the firewall license of the fortigate 50e product is about to expire. It's worth setting your shipping address to Europe to see if there are local listings.
It says free international shipping, and even considering the extra cost, it looks cheap compared to the price stated by the author.

Most routers use a single port to connect the CPU with the built in switch, so if you get a manageable switch and hook it up to the router's LAN port you are almost as good as with a router with a built in switch. Heck, you can even use a cheap OpenWrt WiFi-router configured as dumb AP to also do double duty as managed switch...

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I am actually thinking of a possible upgrade to the good old Linksys WRT1900ACS. I currently use it wired only. The physical space of the cable box is barely enough for the router's dimensions (246 x 194 x 52 mm):

Most likely will not be able to squeeze in 2 devices (switch + miniPC (?)) in this space.

Orange pi 6s?

Mmmh, that is not a lot of space, and it might trap heat and has the risk to slowly "cook" your router/switch, but I guess it worked with the old router so as long as the replacement is not much worse it will work with a new one.

I guess you need to figure out your priorities and then look at the options...

I guess a mini PC and a 5 port switch might actually fit, but then you need two power supplies, eating up more space and producing heat....
Once you come to a solution, it would be great if you could give an update here what you choose and how it worked out?

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As others suggested easily. The 2 smallest x86 is the ace t8 plus (gigabit nic + active cooling) and the new x86 P5 ( 2.5 nic + passive cooling, just search aliexpress for x86 p5).
Get a switch which has 12v input. Get a nice GAN usb-c pd charger, that can output 12v3A in one usbc port and ~12V2A or whatever the switch needs on a 2nd port, and use some usb-c to 12V dc cables.
Probably that's how i would do it.

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Hmm, did you mean Orange Pi R1?

Can't find Orange pi 6s..