Yep. You need to do that: the whole airtime fairness things was dropped from the release today by https://git.lede-project.org/?p=source.git;a=commit;h=c296ba834db4ce8c71e0ad7030aab188fe60b27b
> nbd:
> several users reported stability issues. Revert it now so it doesn't cause issues for the upcoming release
Alas. Thanks for the heads up...
Just my two cents: I'm really not comfortable with the style of that page's language. It sounds too much like a Kickstarter steadfastly making loft promises. At the same time it is already hesitant to go full-on advertisement. So now it's neither a good ad nor a good project abstract. IMHO.
But if you really must, please at least do not deal in absolutes: "LEDE works better", "LEDE is more secure", "LEDE is resistant", "any vulnerabilities are[sic] closed." You do not know that, and you certainly cannot promise it. Sure, it may be like that for you, and may be like that at the moment. But the forums are full of people whose experience has been worse than stock firmware (for example with NAT or Wifi speeds), and we still don't even have any release cycle for people to rely on to get these "vulnerabilities closed." And most importantly, you cannot make promises to the world on behalf of a group of volounteers.
Again, just my two cents.
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I pointed that out earlier as well - so maybe I should put it more bluntly: we are not looking to proselytise; we are not peddling any wares; we are not selling anything.
So please, do not communicate like we are.
If i were someone looking for an alternative firmware, I'd skip LEDE if that kind of sales pitch was my first encounter.
Don't make promises you cannot back up. Don't be corporate.
We all have the best interest of this project at heart, and what you do is valued, but don't let your enthusiasm for this project interfere with the neutral and 'dry' approach (for lack of a better word) such a page should have.
I fully agree with metai and Borromini.
@hnyman's note (#8) plus the sincere comments above make me change my opinion about the page.
I had been hoping that we would be able to ship the first release with at least two killer features that are not in stock firmware. (The bufferbloat/QoS fixes are in and solid, but the airtime fairness only applies to ath9k chips, and got pulled from the first release since it seems still to cause problems.)
So as I re-read it, I realize the current wording in start2 overstates our capabilities at this time. It talks about facilities I hope to get, but it would be misleading say it now.
I am willing to step back from the home page discussion to let someone else manage it. My request is that it have the elements I mentioned in LEDE Showcase page, which are (slightly edited):
- An introductory paragraph that tells what LEDE is about
- A note that says LEDE is still in flux (that can go away shortly after the release.)
- A list of "teasers" in a "Why use LEDE" section with...
- A link to the longer "Reasons to Use LEDE" page
- An invitation to have people join the project
Thanks.
With the recent legal changes in UK, highlighting dnscrypt-proxy for UK-based users could be a priority.
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I took a break from thinking about the home page. As I come back to it, I can see that my "aspirational" writing was too far advanced (too much "marketing speak") for people's tastes, and for the actual state of the project. That writing needed to be dialed back.
In reviewing all the notes in this topic. I come to the conclusion that @bobafetthotmail had the best basis for the home page. I've revised start2 to incorporate his basic layout and bullets, with a place for links to the corresponding "Reasons to use LEDE" page that expands on it.
https://lede-project.org/playground/start2
I welcome comments on this revision. Thanks.
Overall I like the wording, just some more nit-picking: the page states
Security: LEDE's standard installation is secure by default, with no poor passwords [...]
Given that we ship with no password at all we should probably not mention poor passwords but elaborate on the fact that wifi is disabled by default or something.
Apart from that I do like it!
Ok, I've voiced my opinion, edited the page -- I give up on the fight with terminology like "people believe" and "people find". I strongly believe it does not belong to any of the pages of any technical project. State the facts and let users come to their own conclusions.
PS. Whatever "reasons for LEDE" are included in the start page, they should be duplicated in the "reasons to use LEDE" page. In other words, the start page should include the subset of items listed on "reasons to use LEDE" and maybe the better approach would be to pick 5-6 most important ones rather than trying to come up with something else.
@jow - I tweaked the wording about passwords and wifi off. Is it better?
@stangri - thank you for your concession on "people find" and "people believe." I think it's good balance between saying "LEDE is the Best!" and leaving people to guess about the benefits. I think this text can serve for the first stable release (the branch may occur this weekend.)
You're also right that the Reasons to Use LEDE page should have the same section headings as the bullet points on the home page. I took a shot at harmonizing the bullet items/headings between those two pages.
@all - In order to be ready for an onslaught of new visitors who will come when we publicly announce the first release candidate:
-
We need to agree on the content of the home page. I think there's broad willingness to use the format of the page at start2. But it would benefit from a final editorial pass.
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The "Reasons" page needs a similar editorial pass.
-
The "Reasons" page also has a bunch of links to non-existent pages. What's the consensus for handling those links?
Thanks all for this hard work!
There's a difference between concession and giving up the fight. I've never advocated "LEDE is the best", what I suggested was "LEDE is superior to most of the factory firmware in the following: ... (shortened list of why use lede)."
I still strongly believe that the way it's phrased right now is weak and reminds me of the herbal supplement sites or more recently a certain political figure (people say... some people...) -- instead of stating the facts you rely on opinion of some unknown people.
I've done everything I could on this, including modifying the wording and yet it's changed back now. So I give up.
There can be only one answer to this: Create those missing pages and fill them with life! 
Yes, I know, easier said than done...
I don't feel so strongly about that text that I want us all to get hung up. How close are we to agreement?
Let's assume we can make those sentences "better" - that is, acceptable to all the contributors on this topic. What about the rest of those pages?
-
Is the rest of the start2 page good enough? Formatting? Right topics in the list? Reasonable wording for the items?
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Is the Reasons page good enough? Same questions...
Thanks.
I still don't understand why "LEDE is a complete replacement for the vendor-supplied firmware for hundreds of different home and small-office routers and embedded devices." is listed under "Why use LEDE?".
When I read "Why use LEDE?", I expect a "because...", but in this very first sentence, I don't see any.
IMO this sentence fits far better in the neighbourhood of "The LEDE Project (“Linux Embedded Development Environment”) is a Linux operating system based on OpenWrt, targeting a wide range of wireless routers and non-network devices.", which answers the question: "What is LEDE?".
Mixing both sentences together results in this proposal:
"The LEDE Project (“Linux Embedded Development Environment”) is a Linux operating system based on OpenWrt. It is a complete replacement for the vendor-supplied firmware of a wide range of wireless routers and non-network devices. See the [[toh:start|Table of Hardware]] for supported devices."
This answers the question "What is LEDE?", and, coming from "a wide range of...", also answers the question "What is this 'wide range'" or "Which devices are supported?".
Why use LEDE?
- The "More..." links are a good idea. Thanks richb!
- Why is the order of the reasons on https://lede-project.org/playground/reasons_to_use_lede and https://lede-project.org/playground/start2 different? Can the order be the same on both pages?
Otherwise: Good to go!
OK, did the final cut and moved start2 to the frontpage.
To do: https://lede-project.org/reasons_to_use_lede#extensibility -> Create missing pages
A tiny nit... The first character of the body text is '"' This, and its matching close '"' should be removed. Thanks!
Yes, we need to decide how to handle those links.
I am reluctant to suggest a wholesale copy/paste of the OpenWrt pages. That misses the opportunity to a) test it with LEDE, and b) fix/update/improve the words on the previous page.
Since nobody liked my half-fast ("half assed") redirection page idea , perhaps the Extensibility section should call out:
- packages whose description has moved over to the LEDE site, and
- packages whose description is still on the OpenWrt site
e.g.,
Extensibility
- Local page 1
- Local page 2
- ...
- These packages from OpenWrt seem to work well
- OpenWrt page 1
- OpenWrt page 2
- ...
I can volunteer to move over the Bufferbloat/SQM page.
I have been waiting for the "How To" issue to come up.
I agree copying over the old OpenWrt articles untested is not good.
I will suggest that, like OpenWrt, there is a "How To" index page with an entry to it in the "Documentation" section of the side menu. I think that it is, relative to the actual authoring, easy to build an index and like Rich did for Bufferfloat/SQM create the place holder pages. I would then link to the OpenWrt page and solicit the community to test and author LEDE pages. I would also like to see a field (or 2) on the pages for "Tested LEDE Versions", easy for release versions, maybe not so for trunk versions (as of, up to?)
Indirectly related, should there be "User Guide" content on both the "Docs\Start" page and the page called "User Guide". Same for the Developer Guide. It's duplicate content that will over time become more and more inconsistent.